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Dialogues Conclusive and Inconclusive

Dialogues Conclusive and Inconclusive. October 7, 2003. The problem with the Crito. David Hume (1748) : Socrates “builds a Tory consequence of passive obedience on a Whig foundation of the original contract”

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Dialogues Conclusive and Inconclusive

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  1. Dialogues Conclusive and Inconclusive October 7, 2003

  2. The problem with the Crito • David Hume (1748) : Socrates “builds a Tory consequence of passive obedience on a Whig foundation of the original contract” • “Tory”: the foundation of society is authority as represented by Crown, Church and Law. • “Whig”: society exists because citizens freely enter into a contract for mutual protection; law is the means of their agreement. • Socrates seems to be saying both that we enter freely into a contract to be citizens, and that our obligation is total and blind.

  3. Let’s think about dialogue

  4. Ongoing Dialogue

  5. Ongoing=Dialogue

  6. Refusing dialogue • With whom? • Under what conditions? • With what justifications? • Did it ever happen to you?

  7. Ideal dialogue • Never concludes • Never excludes -- how about Socratic dialogue? Inclusive? Egalitarian? When does it stop? Compare with the dialogue of the law courts

  8. You had your chance • “If we leave this place without first persuading the State to let us go, are we or are we not doing an injury?” (89) • The Laws say: “Do you not realize… that you must either persuade your country or do whatever it orders?”

  9. The laws / the Laws • Dialogue in the law court (of which we have one side represented in the Apology) • Limited in time and scope • Concludes, necessarily, with acquittal or conviction • Fictive dialogue with the Laws (Crito) • Not a discussion between equals

  10. Freedom vs. equality • Can Socrates be a destroyer of the laws? • Threat of disobedience equal and opposite to the laws’ power: as if Socrates’ power to do harm were indeed infinite (and so a sign of his power to do good?) • The laws command total obedience because the citizen is not a slave (91, 93)

  11. Immortality • The Laws: “When you enter the next world, you may plead this in your defence before the authorities there” • Fixing the bounds of dialogue / referring the issue to a further authority

  12. The waffling many • “the concerns of the ordinary public, who think nothing of putting people to death, and would bring them back to life if they could, with equal indifference to reason” (87)

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